THOUGHTS ON THE DAILY DAF
brought to you by Kollel Iyun Hadaf of Har Nof
Rosh Kollel: Rav Mordecai Kornfeld
Ask A Question about the Daf
(1) THE MINIMUM AMOUNT REQUIRED FOR CHALAH
QUESTION: The first of the three occasions on which Shamai and Hillel
argued was concerning the minimum amount of dough required for Chalah to be
separated from the dough. There were three opinions -- Shamai, Hillel, and
the Chachamim. Shamai required that there be at least one Kav of dough in
order for one to be obligated to separate Chalah from it. Hillel required
two Kavim. The Chachamim said that there must be at least one and a half
Kavim of dough.
(2) SPEAKING IN THE DIALECT OF ONE'S REBBI
The Chachamim's opinion is simple to understand. One and a half Kavim is
equivalent to the quantity of Mann that fell for each person every day in
the desert (since there are 432 eggs in one Eifah, 1/10 of an Eifah equals
43.2 eggs, which equals 1.8 Kavim in Midbariyos units (24 eggs = 1 Kav),
which is 1.5 Kavim in Yerushalmiyos units). The Sages derive from a verse
that the requirement of Chalah is equivalent to the amount of Mann that
fell for each person.
However, what is the reasoning of Shamai and Hillel? What were they arguing
(a) TOSFOS (DH Shamai Omer) cites the Yerushalmi that explains that Shamai
and Hillel also learned their amounts from the Mann, but they measured the
Mann differently from the way the Chachamim measured it. Even though the
Mann that fell each day was 1/10 of an Eifah, they both understood that the
tenth was a tenth *from the outside* (that is, if it is added with another
nine parts, it equals ten parts), or, in our terms, *one-ninth* of an
Eifah. (The Mann, therefore, measured 48 eggs (1/9 of 432), which equals 2
Hillel maintained that Chalah must be separated from dough of that
quantity, hence he requires at least 2 Kavim. Shamai said that Chalah needs
to be taken from *one meals' worth* of the quantity of Mann that fell.
Since two meals' worth of Mann came down, and the total amount of Mann was
2 Kavim, Shamai requires that Chalah be separated from 1 Kav of dough.
(Accordingly, Hillel and Shamai are not discussing the same type of Kavim
that the Chachamim are discussing. They are discussing Kavim of Midbariyos
units, and the Chachamim are discussing Kavim of Yerushalmiyos units.)
(b) The RASHBA cites RABEINU TAM who explains the reason of Hillel and
Shamai. Hillel and Shamai agree that the amount of Chalah that the Torah
wants us to separate is a significant amount, which means a measure of at
least one egg. The Torah, then, only requires us to separate Chalah if
there is enough dough in order to separate from it one whole egg unit of
dough as Chalah.
The Mishnah (in Maseches Chalah) teaches that a Ba'al ha'Bayis (one baking
bread for his own personal use) separates 1/24th of his dough for Chalah,
and a professional baker (who uses large amounts of dough) separates only
1/48th for Chalah. This fair percentage must also have been the practice
before the Rabanan officially instituted it. Hillel maintained that one Kav
of dough is the minimum amount that can be obligated in Chalah, because
when the Ba'al ha'Bayis separates 1/24th, he will have one egg's worth
(because 1 Kav = 24 eggs). Shamai maintained that the Torah was also
referring to a professional baker, so the minimum amount of dough that is
obligated in Chalah is 2 Kavim (so that when one separates 1/48th of it, he
will have one egg's worth).
QUESTION: Hillel said that a "M'lo Hin" of drawn water will invalidate a
Mikvah. Hillel concluded his opinion by saying, "... because a person is
required to speak the way his Rebbi speaks." What was Hillel excusing
himself for with that statement?
(a) RASHI (DH she'Chayav) explains that Hillel was explaining why he used
the name for the unit of measure that the Torah uses ("Hin"), and not the
name of the measure used by the Rabanan ("Lug").
(b) RAMBAM (PERUSH HA'MISHNAYOS, Eduyos 1:3) explains in the name of his
father that since Hillel's teachers, Shemaya and Avtalyon, were converts
(Berachos 19a), they spoke with the inflection of the language of the land
in which they were raised. Instead of saying "M'lo *Hin*," they pronounced
it "M'lo *Ein*." Hillel would therefore say it with the mispronunciation of
his teachers and excuse himself, "I know that I mispronounced it, but that
is the way my Rebbi spoke!"
(c) The VILNA GA'ON (Eduyos 1:3) explains that it does not seem sensible
that a person is required to mispronounce words the way his Rebbi did.
Instead, he explains that since Shemaya and Avtalyon could not pronounce
"Hin" properly and said "Ein" instead, they feared that their students
might misunderstand what they were saying. They might think that their
teachers were saying "*Ein* Mayim She'uvim Poslim Es ha'Mikvah" -- "drawn
water does *not* invalidate a Mikvah," instead of "*Hin* Mayim She'uvim
Poslim..." -- "a *Hin* of drawn water invalidates a Mikvah." Therefore,
they would phrase their Halachah by saying, "*M'lo* Hin Poslim Es
ha'Mikvah" -- "a *full* Hin...," so that the students would not
misunderstand it. When Hillel repeated it, although he pronounced "Hin"
properly and it was not necessary for him to say "M'lo Hin," he
nevertheless added the word "M'lo" because that is the way his Rebbi said
(d) The DOROS RISHONIM explains that all three Sages (Shamai, Hillel, and
the Chachamim) had received through oral tradition their opinions as to how
much drawn water invalidates a Mikvah. Their oral tradition was common in
that it said that a Mikvah is invalidated by *3* of some measure (Shamai
said 9 Kavin, which is *3* Hin; the Chachamim said *3* Lugin; and Hillel
said a Hin, which is *3* Kavin). Hillel and Shamai did not specifically use
the number 3 with the appropriate unit of measure, even though that was the
tradition they had received, because they were saying it the way they had
heard it from their Rebbi.
(3) THE TWO STAGES OF THE DECREE OF GLASS VESSELS
QUESTION: The Gemara challenges the Beraisa that says that Yosi Ben Yo'ezer
and Yosi Ben Yochanan were the first to enact the decree that the land
outside of Israel (Eretz ha'Amim) will make a person Tamei, because we know
that the late Sages instituted that decree. The Gemara answers that YBY and
YBY originally made the decree, and the later Sages added to it.
(4) A BROKEN GLASS VESSEL REPAIRED WITH LEAD
However, this does not answer the question on the second decree enacted by
YBY and YBY, the decree that glass vessels will become Tamei, which the
Gemara also asserts was made by the later Sages. If the same answer applies
-- that the later Sages *added* to the original decree -- what did they
add? They could not have added that the Tumah of glassware requires Terumah
to be *burned*, because the Gemara (16a) explicitly says that it causes
Terumah to be Toleh and not burned (as a reminder that the Tumah of
glassware is not mid'Oraisa).
(a) TOSFOS (DH Asu Inhu) answers that the initial decree was to be Toleh
the Terumah that touched *any* part of the glass vessel. The later Sages
added that if Terumah touches the *inside* of the glass vessel, it must be
burned. When the Gemara later says that glassware can only require Terumah
to be Toleh, but not burned, it is referring to Tumah that is caused by the
Terumah touching the *outside* of the glass vessel.
(b) TOSFOS suggests another answer. Originally, the decree on glassware was
not accepted. The later Sages re-enacted the decree, and it was accepted.
(Tosfos says that this is actually the text of some Gemaras.)
QUESTION: The Gemara cites an argument between Rebbi Meir and the Rabanan
concerning a case of a glass vessel that was punctured and the hole was
filled with lead. Rebbi Meir maintains that it can become Tamei because it
is considered to be a metal vessel, because that which makes the vessel
useful is the metal patch (it is the "Ma'amid"). The Rabanan say that we do
not attribute the laws of the "Ma'amid" to the entire vessel, and thus it
is not considered to be a metal vessel and cannot become Tamei.
However, even if the Rabanan say that we do not attribute the laws of the
"Ma'amid" to the mended glass vessel, they should not say that the glass
vessel is *Tahor*. Since it is repaired, it should become Tamei
mid'Rabanan, like any other glass vessel!
(a) RASHI in Rosh Hashanah (19b, DH v'Chachamim Metaharin) and TOSFOS here
(DH Chachamim) explain that the Rabanan were only saying that the glass
vessel does not become Tamei *mid'Oraisa* like a metal vessel; it will, of
course, still become Tamei with the Tumah *d'Rabanan* that the Sages
decreed upon glassware.
(b) RASHI in Rosh Hashanah (19a, DH Yehudah) gives another explanation. The
argument between Rebbi Meir and the Rabanan involves *Tumah Yeshanah*,
*retroactive Tumah*. If a metal vessel becomes Tamei and is then broken so
that it is no longer a vessel, it loses its Tumah. However, when the metal
vessel is repaired, it reverts to its original Tumah. Rebbi Meir says that
a glass vessel that was repaired with lead reverts to its original Tumah,
because it is now considered to be a metal vessel. The Rabanan say that it
is still only a glass vessel, and thus it does not return to its original
Tumah when it is repaired (like earthenware), and it is *Tahor* until
touching Tumah once again.
(c) The RASHBAM (cited in Tosfos here and in Tosfos in Rosh Hashanah) says
that Rebbi Meir and the Rabanan agree that we follow the "Ma'amid" and give
the glass vessel the laws of the material that was used to repair it. The
argument is whether plugging a glass with lead *will serve as a proper
plug*. Rebbi Meir says that it is usable, and therefore it is Tamei. The
Rabanan say that it is not usable, and therefore it is not considered a
utensil and it is Tahor. (The Rashban had an alternate text in the Gemara
which omitted the words, "We follow the Ma'amid.")
(d) RASHI here (DH Metamei) explains that according to the Rabanan, a glass
vessel that is broken is like any *earthenware* vessel that is broken,
which is never considered a utensil even after it is repaired. The argument
between Rebbi Meir and the Rabanan is whether it is considered *metal* now
that it was fixed with lead, or whether it is still considered like
earthenware. Tosfos cites a Tosefta that supports this view, that if an
earthenware vessel is broken, it can never again become Tamei.
(However, Tosfos and most other Rishonim interpret the Tosefta differently,
proving that it is talking about a broken earthenware vessel that breaks a
*second* time. Since it has broken a second time, it is basically unusable.
After the first break and repair, it is still usable and will become Tamei.
Rashi might respond that a glass utensil that breaks for the *first* time
is like an earthenware utensil that breaks for the *second* time, because
glass is much more fragile - M. Kornfeld)