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Rosh Kollel: Rabbi Mordecai Kornfeld

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Kidushin 32

KIDUSHIN 32-35 - Ari Kornfeld has generously sponsored the Dafyomi publications for these Dafim for the benefit of Klal Yisrael.


(a) (Beraisa) Question: What is fear of parents, what is honor?
(b) Answer: Fear - one does not sit or stand in his father's place, he does not contradict him, nor prove that his father is right;
(c) Honor - He gives him to eat and drink, he clothes him, covers him, transports him.
(d) Question: Must the son honor his father from his own money?
(e) Answer #1 (Rav Yehudah): Yes.
(f) Answer #2 (R. Noson bar Oshiya): No, only from the father's money.
1. R. Yirmeyah asked; he was told to conduct as R. Noson.
(g) Question (Beraisa): It says "Honor your father and mother", and "Honor Hash-m from your wealth" - just as one must spend money to honor Hash-m, also to honor parents.
1. If honor of parents is from the parents' money, the son gets back whatever money he spends!
(h) Answer: He is not reimbursed for time he spent honoring them and was unable to work.
(i) (Beraisa): The following pairs - either member can redeem Ma'aser Sheni of the other without adding a fifth; either member can feed the other Ma'aser Oni (if the latter is poor):
1. Two brothers; 2 partners; a father and son; a Rebbi and Talmid.
2. Question: If the son must spend to honor his father, how can he fulfill his obligation with Ma'aser Oni?!
3. Answer: He must use his own money to feed the father the basics; Ma'aser Oni can only be used for extras.
4. Question: (Beraisa): R. Yehudah says, a curse will come upon one who feeds his father Ma'aser Oni!
i. If the Ma'aser Oni is only for extras, what is wrong with this?
5. Answer: Still, it is disgraceful.
(j) (Beraisa - R. Eliezer): The extent of honoring parents - if the parent would throw the child's wallet in the sea, the child must not embarrass the parent.
1. Question: If honor of parents is from the parents' money, the son gets his money back, this is not so hard!
2. Answer: The case is, the child stands to inherit the parent.
3. Rav Huna tore silk in front of his son Rabah, to see if Rabah would get angry.
4. Question: How could he do that - if he would get angry, Rav Huna would have transgressed putting a stumbling block before the blind!
5. Answer: Rav Huna pardoned his honor (so Rabah would not transgress if he got angry).
6. Question: But Rav Huna transgressed wasting money!
7. Answer: He tore it at the seams, so it did not depreciate.
8. Question: If so, why would Rabah get angry?
9. Answer: Rav Huna (looked) angry when he tore it (so Rabah would assume that it was torn destructively).
(a) (Rav Yechezkel - Mishnah - R. Shimon): People sentenced to be burned that became mixed with people standing to be stoned - they are stoned, because this is less severe than burning.
(b) (Rami (his son)): Father, don't teach that way - 'were mixed with people standing to be stoned' connotes that the majority should be stoned - even if burning was not more severe, they would be stoned!
1. Rather, teach 'People sentenced to be stoned that became mixed with people standing to be burned (they are stoned, because this is less severe)'.
(c) Question (Rav Yechezkel - the end of the Mishnah): Chachamim say, they are burned, because this is less severe.
1. Since the majority should be burned - even if burning not was less severe, they would be burned!
(d) Answer (Rami): Chachamim merely come to argue on R. Shimon and say that stoning is more severe (R. Shimon already taught that we always give the lighter punishment).
1. Shmuel (to Rami): You shouldn't speak that way to your father!
i. (Beraisa): A man saw his father transgress a Torah law. He should not say 'Father, you transgressed'; rather, he should say 'Father, this is what the Torah says'.
ii. Question: That will pain the father!
iii. Correction: Rather, he says 'Father, there is a verse in the Torah that says...'
(a) (Beraisa - R. Elazar ben Masya): If father asks me to serve him, and I have a Mitzvah to do - the Mitzvah takes precedence, because my father is also obligated to do Mitzvos;
1. Isi ben Yehudah says, if the Mitzvah can be done by others, the son should serve his father.
(b) (Rav Masnah): The law is as Isi.
(c) (R. Yitzchak bar Shilo): A father can pardon the honor due to him, a Rebbi cannot;
(d) (Rav Yosef): Even a Rebbi can pardon his honor - "Hash-m went before (Yisrael) by day (in a cloud)."
(e) Question (Rava): That is not comparable!
1. Hash-m owns the whole world, so he can pardon his honor;

2. A Rebbi does not own his Torah!
(f) Answer (Rava): I erred - a Rebbi does own his Torah - "In his Torah he will think day and night"!
(g) Question: But Rava was serving at a meal honoring Rava's son's wedding; Rav Papa and Rav Huna brei d'Rav Yehoshua stood up for Rava;
1. Rav Mari and Rav Pinchas, sons of Rav Chisda, did not stand for Rava, and Rava was upset!
i. Rava: Do you consider yourselves Chachamim, and Rav Papa and Rav Huna are not?!
2. A similar episode occurred in which R. Yitzchak brei d'Rav Yehudah did not stand for Rav Papa.
(h) Answer: Even if the Rebbi pardons his honor, the Talmid should move a bit to show honor.
(i) (Rav Ashi): Even according to the opinion that a Rebbi can pardon his honor, a Nasi cannot.
(j) Question (Beraisa): When R. Gamliel married off his son, he was serving at the meal. R. Eliezer refused to take from him; R. Yehoshua took from him.
1. R. Eliezer: How can we sit while R. Gamliel stands and serves us?!
2. R. Yehoshua: We find someone greater that served - Avraham was the greatest of his generation, and he served his guests!
i. He did not know they were angels, he thought they were nomads!
3. R. Tzadok: Why do you speak of mortals and neglect Hash-m?!
i. Hash-m brings winds, raises clouds, makes rain fall, makes vegetation flourish, and sets a table before everyone - all the more so, R. Gamliel can serve us!
(k) Correction: Rather, Rav Ashi taught, even according to the opinion that a Nasi can pardon his honor, a king cannot;
1. "You will put a king upon you" - his fear should be upon you.
(a) (Beraisa): "You will rise for an elder" - one might have thought, even for a wicked, unlearned elder - "Zaken (elder)";
1. "Zaken" connotes a Chacham - "Gather for me 70 men from the Zekenim of Yisrael".
2. R. Yosi ha'Gelili says, "Zaken" denotes 'Zeh she'KaNah (this that acquired Chachmah)'.
(b) Suggestion: Perhaps one must rise when the Zaken is far away.
(c) Rejection: "You will rise and honor" - the Mitzvah to rise is only where it will honor him (nearby, where it is evident why he stood).
(d) Suggestion: Perhaps one must give money to the Zaken to honor him.
(e) Rejection: "You will rise and honor" - just as one does not lose money by rising, one does not lose by honoring.
(f) Suggestion: Perhaps one must rise even in the Beis ha'Kisei or bathhouse.
(g) Rejection: "You will rise and honor" - the Mitzvah to rise is only in a place fit to honor him.
(h) Suggestion: Perhaps one may close his eyes as if he does not see the Zaken (to avoid having to rise).
(i) Rejection: "You will rise and you will fear" - any Mitzvah that depends on one's intention, it says "you will fear Hash-m (who knows your intention)".
(j) (R. Shimon ben Elazar): "Zaken and you will fear" - this teaches that a Zaken should not unnecessarily cause that people must rise for him.
(k) (Isi ben Yehudah): "You will rise in front of an elder" - any elder;
(l) Question: The first Tana and R. Yosi ha'Gelili agree!
(m) Answer: They argue whether one must rise for a young Chacham; R. Yosi ha'Gelili says, one must.
(n) Question: What is his reason?
(o) Answer: If one must rise only for an old Chacham, the Torah should have written 'In front of an old Zaken, rise and honor';
1. Rather, it did not write "old" and "Zaken" adjacently, to teach that one can be "old" without being "Zaken" or vice-versa.
(p) The first Tana holds that if 2 different people are included, the Torah should have said 'In front of an elder, rise and honor; rise and honor a Zaken';
1. Rather, the Torah refers to 1 person (an old Chacham).
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