POINT BY POINT SUMMARY
Prepared by Rabbi P. Feldman
of Kollel Iyun Hadaf, Yerushalayim
Rosh Kollel: Rabbi Mordecai Kornfeld
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Previous daf Kidushin 12
1) HOW MUCH IS A PERUTAH?
(a) (Mishnah): Beis Hillel say, a Perutah...
2) ENGAGEMENT WITH ITEMS OF SMALL VALUE
(b) (Rav Yosef): Any coin which is now considered a Perutah
may be used (even if it has been devalued).
(c) Question (Abaye - Mishnah): A Perutah is an eighth of an
Italian Isar. (If a (current) Perutah is not worth this
much, it cannot engage!)
1. Suggestion: Perhaps the Mishnah refers to in Moshe's
day, but today, any accepted currency, no matter how
small, can engage.
(d) Counter-question (Rav Yosef - Beraisa): There are more
than 2000 Perutos in 2 Sela'im.
2. Rejection: Rav Dimi reported that R. Simai
calculated the Perutah in his generation, and found
it to be one eighth of an Italian Isar;
i. (Ravin): R. Dostoy and...calculated the Perutah
in their generation, and found it to be one
sixth of an Italian Isar.
1. If the Perutah is fixed (it must be as in Moshe's
day, 1 part in 192 of a Dinar), there are less than
2000 Perutos in 2 Sela'im!
(e) Correction (An elder): The Beraisa should say close to
(f) Question: But there are only 1536!
(g) Answer: Since it is closer to 2000 than 1000, the Tana
calls it close to 2000.
(h) (Rav Dimi): R. Simai calculated the Perutah - it was one
eighth of an Italian Isar;
(i) (Ravin): R. Dostoy and...calculated the Perutah - it was
one sixth of an Italian Isar.
1. Suggestion (Abaye): You (Rav Dimi) and Ravin argue
as the following Tana'im!
2. (Beraisa): A Perutah is an eighth of an Italian
i. A Dinar is 6 Mo'oh...(a Mo'oh is 4 Isarim; an
Isar is 8 Perutos);
3. R. Shimon ben Gamliel says...(a Mo'oh is 24 Perutos
- it follows, a Perutah is one sixth of an Italian
4. Answer (Rav Dimi): No, Ravin and I both hold as the
i. When the Isar is devalued, there are 32 Isarim
in a Dinar (hence 6 Perutos in an Isar); when
the Isar is increased, there are 24 Isarim in a
Dinar (hence 8 Perutos in an Isar).
(a) (Shmuel): A man engaged a woman with a date - even if
dates sell for much less than a Perutah, we are
concerned, perhaps they are worth a Perutah in Madai
(b) Question: (Mishnah): Beis Hillel say, a Perutah or the
value of a Perutah engages -it follows, less than a
Perutah does not!
(c) Answer: A Perutah makes definite engagement; less than a
Perutah creates a doubtful engagement.
(d) Reuven engaged Leah with a piece of marble; Rav Chisda
was calculating if it was worth a Perutah.
1. Question: But Shmuel taught, even if it is not worth
a Perutah, we are concerned!
2. Answer: Rav Chisda argues on Shmuel.
3. Leah's mother: On the day he engaged her, it was
worth a Perutah!
4. Rav Chisda: You are not believed (to say this, which
would forbid her to Shimon, who engaged her after
3) IMPROPER KINDS OF ENGAGEMENT
i. This is as the case of Yehudis, R. Chiya's wife
(who had painful pregnancies and wanted to be
5. Rabanan (to Rav Chisda): There are witnesses abroad
that the rock was worth a Perutah that day!
ii. Yehudis: My mother told me that my father
engaged me (to someone else) when I was young!
iii. R. Chiya: She is not believed to forbid you to
6. Rav Chisda: Since they are not here, we are not
concerned for them.
i. Suggestion: This is as R. Chanina's ruling.
7. The woman married someone else. In Sura, Chachamim
refused to intermarry with her children.
ii. (R. Chanina): We will not forbid a woman that
was captured, just because there are rumors
that there are witnesses abroad (that know she
was captured; if they would testify before us,
we would forbid her).
iii. Rejection: (Abaye and Rava): No - R. Chanina
is only lenient by a captured woman, for she
makes herself repulsive to the captors (even if
the rumors are true, she probably was not
iv. Here, we cannot be lenient - if the rumors are
true, she is married to Reuven!
i. This is not because they hold as Shmuel;
rather, they hold as Abaye and Rava.
(a) Question (Rav Acha bar Huna): A man engaged a woman with
a myrtle branch in the market - what is the law?
(b) Answer (Rav Yosef): He is lashed, as Rav holds; she is
doubtfully engaged to him, as Shmuel.
1. Rav lashes one who does any of the following:
i. Engaging in the market, or engaging through
relations, or engaging without prior agreement;
2. Question: Is he only lashed if he lives by her, not
for passing by?
ii. Nullifying a Get (that was sent through a
messenger, for his wife may remarry before
hearing that the Get is void);
iii. Telling witnesses that the Get he gave was not
given willingly (and is invalid - this will
make people suspect that his wife's future
children are Mamzerim);
iv. One who annoys a messenger of Chachamim;
v. One who is excommunicated, and does not request
within 30 days that it be lifted;
vi. A man that lives by his mother-in-law.
i. Rav Sheshes lashed a man for passing by his
3. Answer: That was a special case, that man was
suspected of relations with her.
4. (Nehardai): [Version #1: Rav only lashes one who
engages through relations without prior agreement.]
5. [Version #2: Rav lashes one who engages through
relations, even with prior agreement, for this is