POINT BY POINT SUMMARY
Prepared by Rabbi P. Feldman
of Kollel Iyun Hadaf, Yerushalayim
Rosh Kollel: Rabbi Mordecai Kornfeld
Ask A Question on the daf
Previous daf Chulin 115
1) OTHER FORBIDDEN ACTIONS
(a) Question: Things made on Shabbos should be forbidden
(they are abominations)!
2) BENEFIT FROM "BASAR V'CHALAV"
(b) Answer: "It (Shabbos) is Kodesh to you" - but what is
made on Shabbos is not Kodesh.
(c) Suggestion: If one plowed with an ox and donkey together,
or threshed with a muzzled ox, this should forbid (Rashi
- the produce; Tosfos - the animals)!
(d) Rejection: Melachah on Shabbos is a severe Isur, yet
things made on Shabbos are permitted - working with
diverse species or with a muzzled animal is a less severe
Isur, all the more it does not forbid!
(e) Suggestion: If different species are planted together,
the produce should be forbidden!
(f) Rejection: It says regarding Kil'ei ha'Kerem (different
species planted in a vineyard or with grapes), "Tukdash."
We read this "Tukad Esh" (the produce will be burned);
(g) Inference: Kil'ei Zera'im (different species planted
together without grapes) are permitted.
(h) Suggestion: Perhaps it is forbidden to eat Kil'ei
Zera'im, but one may benefit from them!
(i) Rejection: They are equated to (offspring of) Kil'ei
Behemah (crossbred animals) - "Behemtecha Lo Sarbi'a
Kil'ayim Sadcha Lo Sizra Kil'ayim";
1. Just like Kil'ei Behemah are permitted, also Kil'ei
(j) Suggestion: If Oso v'Es Beno are slaughtered on the same
day, the latter should be forbidden (it was slaughtered
2. Question: What is the source to permit Kil'ei
3. Answer: The Torah forbids Kil'ei Behemah to the
Mizbe'ach - we infer that they are permitted to
(k) Rejection: The Torah forbids Mechusar Zeman to the
Mizbe'ach (this includes Oso v'Es Beno, it may not be
slaughtered yet) - we infer that it is permitted to
(l) Suggestion: If one took Em Al ha'Banim (a mother bird
resting on its eggs or chicks), the mother should be
(m) Rejection: The Torah commands to send away the mother
(and one who finds it has no reason to suspect that it is
forbidden, he may eat it) - the Torah would not cause a
guiltless person to sin.
(a) Question (Reish Lakish): What is the source that it is
forbidden to benefit from meat cooked with milk?
(b) Answer #1 (Reish Lakish): Regarding Korban Pesach, it
says "Al Tochlu Mimenu Na *u'Vashel Mevushal*" - the
repetition forbids something else cooked, i.e. Basar
1. Question (R. Yochanan): Why don't you learn like
3) QUESTIONS ON A "KAL VA'CHOMER"
(c) Answer #2: (He learns from a Gezeirah Shavah
"Kodesh-Kodesh.") The verse (in Devarim) forbidding Basar
v'Chalav says "You are a Kodesh nation to Hash-m"; and it
says, "There will not be Kadesh in Benei Yisrael" (a man
that cannot Mekadesh, i.e. a slave, may not have
relations with a Bas Yisrael; alternatively, a man may
not wantonly have relations (Rashi - Mishkav Zachar)).
i. (Rebbi): "Do not eat it" - this is extra (other
verses forbid blood), it forbids eating Basar
2. Answer (Reish Lakish): Rebbi teaches the Isur to
eat; I gave the source to forbid benefit.
ii. Question: Perhaps it forbids something else!
iii. Answer: We learn from the context - the verse
discusses two kinds (Tosfos - deer and wild
goat; Rashi - a blemished Korban that was
redeemed, in some ways it is like Chulin, in
some ways it is like Kodshim), it comes to
forbid two kinds.
3. Question: How does Rebbi learn that benefit is
1. Just like Kadesh is an Isur of [relations, which is]
Hana'ah, also Basar v'Chalav.
(d) Answer #3 (d'vei R. Eliezer): It says "Do not eat any
Neveilah (...you may sell it to a Nochri) Lo Sevashel
Gedi ba'Chalev Imo" - when you sell a Neveilah to a
Nochri, you may not cook it (beforehand in milk, for this
would forbid benefit from it).
(e) Answer #4 (Tana d'vei R. Yishmael): Three verses say "Lo
Sevashel Gedi ba'Chalev Imo" - they forbid eating,
benefit and cooking.
(f) Answer #5 (Beraisa - Isi ben Yehudah): One verse
forbidding Basar v'Chalav says "You are a Kodesh nation
to Hash-m"; another says "You will be Kodesh people to
me, do not eat Tereifah meat in the field";
1. Just like Tereifah may not be eaten, also Basar
2. A Kal va'Chomer forbids benefit:
i. Orlah did not result from a sin, yet it is Asur
b'Hana'ah - Basar v'Chalav results from a
transgression, all the more so it is Asur
3. Question: We cannot learn from Orlah, for it never
4. Answer: Chametz (during Pesach) shows that Isur
Hana'ah does not depend on this - it is Asur
b'Hana'ah, even though it was once permitted!
5. Question: We cannot learn from Chametz, for one who
eats it (b'Mezid) gets Kares!
6. Answer: Kil'ei ha'Kerem shows that Isur Hana'ah does
not depend on this (it is Asur b'Hana'ah, even
though it is only a Lav)!
(a) Question: Why is a Gezerah Shavah needed to forbid eating
Basar v'Chalav - this can also be learned from the Kal
1. Orlah did not result from a sin, yet it is Asur to
eat or benefit from it - Basar v'Chalav results from
a transgression, all the more so it is Asur to eat
or benefit from it!
(b) Answer: The Kal va'Chomer can be refuted:
1. It is forbidden to plow with Kilayim (different
species of animals), or with a muzzled animal, yet
nothing becomes forbidden to eat.
(c) Question: Why did the Tana use Kil'ei ha'Kerem to show
that Isur Hana'ah does not depend on Kares - we can learn
this from Orlah itself, and learn Basar v'Chalav from the
Tzad ha'Shaveh of Orlah and Chametz!
2. (Once the Gezerah Shavah forbids eating Basar
v'Chalav, this refutation does not apply (regarding
benefit), for both of these may not be eaten,
whereas forbidden plowing does not forbid anything
to be eaten.)
(d) Answer #1 (Rav Ashi): If we learned from the Tzad
ha'Shaveh, Neveilah would refute the Kal va'Chomer - it
is Asur to eat, but it is Mutar b'Hana'ah!
(e) Objection (Rav Mordechai): We challenge a Tzad ha'Shaveh
only regarding the sources we learn from, not from other
(f) Question (Rav Ashi): How do you answer (Question (c)), we
should learn from the Tzad ha'Shaveh (of Orlah and
(g) Answer (Rav Mordechai): We could challenge it - both
Orlah and Chametz grow from the ground, but Basar
v'Chalav does not.
(h) Question (Rav Ashi): Even now that we also learn from
Kil'ei ha'Kerem, that challenge remains, for Kilayim also
grows from the ground!
(i) Answer (Rav Mordechai): Anything common to the sources in
a Tzad ha'Shaveh, but not in the Lamed (what we want to
learn) is a challenge (even if there is no reason why it
should affect the law).
1. Here, we may not challenge that Kilayim grows from
the ground, unlike Basar v'Chalav, for this is not a
leniency or stringency (which logically should
affect the law).
(j) Question (Rav Ashi): Since we do not learn from Kilayim
alone, rather from all three, it is like a Tzad
ha'Shaveh, we can challenge it - all the sources (Orlah,
Chametz and Kilayim), grow from the ground, unlike Basar
(k) Correction (Rav Mordechai, citing Reish Lakish): Rather,
when we learn from one source (e.g. Kal va'Chomer), we
challenge only from a leniency or stringency;
1. When we learn from two sources, we may challenge
from anything common to the sources (which is not
found in the Lamed);
2. When we learn from three sources:
i. If we [can challenge the third source from a
leniency or stringency, and] must learn from a
Tzad ha'Shaveh, we may challenge from anything
common to the sources;
ii. If we need not learn from a Tzad ha'Shaveh, we
challenge only from a leniency or stringency.