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Kollel Iyun Hadaf, Jerusalem

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Bava Basra 85

BAVA BASRA 82-85 - Sponsored by a generous grant from an anonymous donor. Kollel Iyun Hadaf is indebted to him for his encouragement and support and prays that Hashem will repay him in kind.


(a) Rav and Shmuel both rule that a receptacle belonging to the purchaser acquires everywhere but for the Reshus ha'Rabim.
What do Rebbi Yochanan and Resh Lakish say?

(b) How do we qualify the statement 'Keilav shel Adam Koneh Lo'?

(a) According to Rav Papa, there is no dispute.
How does he explain 'Afilu bi'Reshus ha'Rabim' said by Rebbi Yochanan and Resh Lakish, to arrive at this conclusion?

(b) Then why did they refer to it as 'Reshus ha'Rabim'?

(c) We prove Rav Papa right from a statement of Rebbi Avahu Amar Rebbi Yochanan.
What qualifying statement did he make concerning a person's receptacles?

(a) The Beraisa discusses four Dinim regarding someone who is selling wine or oil, the first by a measure which belongs to neither party and in a Reshus ha'Rabim or a Chatzer that belongs to neither of them (but which they borrowed for the duration of the sale).
To whom do the measured contents belong ...
  1. ... until the measuring process is complete?
  2. ... after it has been completed?
(b) The second Din concerns where the wine or the oil is being poured into the receptacle belonging to one of them.
What is the Din there?

(c) What will be the Din in the third case, where the wine or oil is lying in the domain of the purchaser?

(a) The fourth Din refers to when the wine or oil is lying in the domain of the seller or of the guardian. The purchaser then acquires it in one of four ways, the first through Hagbahah, and the second through Meshichah from the owner's domain to a Simta, as we learned earlier.
What are the third and fourth ways respectively?

(b) The Tana divides the last Din into two parts, connecting the first two with a seller, and the second two with a guardian. What would be the advantage of counting them as two out of the four Dinim (rather than one), and Reshus Mocher and Reshus Loke'ach as the other two?

(c) Seeing as all four Dinim apply both to Reshus Mocher and to Reshus Nifkad, why does the Tana lists Hagbahah and Hotza'ah together with Reshus Mocher, and Kabalah and Sechirus Makom together with Reshus Nifkad?

(a) What are the ramifications of ...
  1. ... 'Ad she'Lo Nismal'es ha'Midah, le'Mocher'?
  2. ... 'mi'she'Nismal'es, le'Loke'ach'?
(b) And what are the ramifications of 'Im Haysah Midah shel Echad Meihen, Rishon Rishon Kanah', assuming that the receptacle belongs to ...
  1. ... the buyer?
  2. ... the seller? Will it make any difference if they fixed the price?
(c) We establish this in a Reshus ha'Rabim or in a Chatzer that belongs to neither of them.
How must we qualify a Chatzer that belongs to neither of them in order to place it in the same category as a Reshus ha'Rabim?

(d) On whom does this Beraisa pose a Kashya?

Answers to questions


6) How must Rav and Shmuel interpret ...

  1. ... 'bi'Reshus ha'Rabim'?
  2. ... 'Chatzer she'Einah shel Sheneihem' (in order to conform with that)?
(a) Rav Sheishes asked Rav Huna whether the receptacle of a purchaser will acquire on his behalf in the seller's domain.
What are the two possible cases?

(b) Perhaps he will acquire the goods because they are, after all, in his receptacle, which is considered his own domain.
Why, on the other hand, might he not acquire them?

(c) What does the Mishnah in Gitin say about a husband who threw his wife a Get which landed in her lap or in her basket?

(d) Why did Rav Nachman protest when Rav Sheishes attempted to resolve his She'eilah from the latter case (on the assumption that his wife was sitting in his house at the time)?

(a) Rav Yehudah Amar Shmuel established the Mishnah there where her basket was hanging from her person; Resh Lakish, where it was tied but not hanging. What is the difference between the two answers?

(b) How does this refute Rav Sheishes proof?

(c) According to Rav Ada bar Ahavah, the basket is lying between her thighs. Will it matter if it is also lying on the floor of the husband's house?

(d) How does this explanation (as well as the subsequent ones), serve to refute Rav Sheishes proof?

(a) Rav Mesharshaya B'rei de'Rav Ami explains that the Mishnah speaks when her husband was a basket-seller.
So what if he was? How does that answer the Kashya?

(b) Rebbi Yochanan explains that it is the *location* of her lap and of her basket that acquires on her behalf.
How does Rava explain this?

(a) So we try to resolve Rav Nachman' She'eilah from the Beraisa 'bi'Reshus Mocher, Lo Kanah ad she'Yagbihenah ... '.
What do we prove from there, assuming that the Tana speaks when the goods are placed in the purchaser's receptacles?

(b) How do we establish the Beraisa to reconcile it with Rav and Shmuel?

(c) And how will we establish the Seifa 'bi'Reshus Loke'ach, Keyvan she'Kibel Alav Mocher, Kanah Loke'ach'?

(d) By what logic we establish the Reisha by receptacles belonging to the seller, and the Seifa by receptacles belonging to the purchaser?

Answers to questions

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