POINT BY POINT SUMMARY
Prepared by Rabbi P. Feldman
of Kollel Iyun Hadaf, Yerushalayim
Rosh Kollel: Rabbi Mordecai Kornfeld
Ask A Question on the daf
Previous daf Bava Basra 88
BAVA BASRA 87 & 88 - dedicated by an admirer of the work of the Dafyomi
Advancement Forum, l'Iluy Nishmas Mrs. Gisela (Golda bas Reb Chaim Yitzchak
Ozer) and Reb Yisroel Shimon (ben Reb Shlomo) Turkel, A"H.
1) IS ONE WHO TAKES AND RETURNS SOMETHING RESPONSIBLE?
(a) Answer #3 (Abaye bar Avin and R. Chanina bar Avin): The
case is, Shimon took the flask to measure (the oil for
Reuven) with it.
2) CLEANING ONE'S MEASURES
1. (Rabah): An animal was lost; a Chacham (who is
exempt from returning it, it is beneath his dignity)
hit it (to make it return by itself) - he is
responsible to return it.
(b) Objection: Rabah said that regarding an animal - once it
strays, it is less likely to return home;
1. We have no source that using a flask (for the sake
of Reuven) obligates him to return it to Reuven!
(c) Answer #4 (Rava and R. Zeira): The case is, Shimon took
the flask to measure with it for others.
1. R. Yehudah holds that one who borrows without
permission is like a borrower, it suffices to return
it to where he took it from (the child);
(d) (Shmuel): If one takes a vessel from a craftsman to see
if he wants to buy it, and Ones occurred, he is liable.
2. Chachamim hold that one who borrows without
permission is like a robber, he must return it to
1. This is only if the price is known.
(e) Levi entered a meat store; he picked up thigh to inspect
it. A horseman came and took it; Rav Yemar obligated Levi
1. This is only because the price was known.
(f) Reuven brought gourds to Fum Nahara to sell; everyone
took one each (intending to buy it; he thought they were
stealing). He said 'They are Hekdesh'!
1. Rav Kahana: A person cannot make Hekdesh something
that is not his (the buyers acquired, they merely
(g) (Beraisa): If Shimon (who is trustworthy about Ma'aseros)
was looking at vegetables to buy them (from Reuven, who
is not trustworthy about Ma'aseros), even for a whole
day, he does not acquire (until he decides absolutely),
he need not tithe them;
2. This is only if the price is known - if not, they
still belonged to Reuven, they are now Hekdesh.
1. If he decided to buy them, he acquires, he must
(h) Question: Because he decided to buy them, he acquires and
must tithe them?!
2. If he later decides to return them, he must first
Ma'aser them; Shimon (gives the Ma'aser to a Levi
and) pays Reuven the value of the Ma'aser, and
returns the remaining vegetables.
(i) Answer (R. Hoshaya): The Beraisa discusses a
Heaven-fearing person, like Rav Safra, who fulfilled
"V'Dover Emes bi'Lvavo" (he fulfilled his intention, even
though he did not say a word).
(a) (Mishnah): A wholesaler cleans his measures once every 30
days (because they are used often, much sticks to them);
(b) A regular person (who sells less frequently) cleans his
measures once every 12 months;
(c) R. Shimon ben Gamliel says, just the contrary (a
wholesaler's vessels are used often, the remaining drops
usually do not dry up and stick to the vessels, once a
year suffices, for a regular person, once every 30 days).
(d) A grocer cleans his measures twice a week, his weights
once a week, and his scale after every weighing.
(e) R. Shimon ben Gamliel says, this applies to (vessels that
hold) liquids; for dry things, there is no need to clean
3) GIVING EXTRA
(a) The grocer must give enough produce to Machri'a (lift the
pan holding the weights) a Tefach (above the produce).
4) WHAT IS MORE SEVERE
(b) If he (is in a place where one) measures evenly, he
compensates by adding extra produce: one part for 10 for
liquids, one for 20 for solids.
(c) In a place where people measure with small vessels, he
should not measure with big vessels (for there will be
1. In a place where people measure with big vessels, he
should not measure with small vessels (the seller
cannot make them so even).
(d) In a place where people sell even measures, he should not
give a heaping measure, or vice-versa (we will explain
(e) (Gemara) Question: What is the source (that one must make
the weights go a Tefach higher)?
(f) Answer (Reish Lakish): "Even Shelemah va'Tzedek" - give
more than the full measure.
(g) Question: But the next clause teaches 'in a place where
people measure evenly, he compensates by adding extra' -
if the Torah requires Hachra'ah, how can he weigh evenly?
(h) Answer: Really, the Torah does not require Hachra'ah (but
where people do so, one must Machri'a a Tefach);
1. The question was, what is the source that 'in a
place where people measure evenly, he compensates by
adding extra'? Reish Lakish answered, "Even Shelemah
(i) Question: How much extra must one give (what does it mean
one part for 10)?
(j) Answer (R. Aba bar Mamal): A tenth of a liter for a sale
of 10 liters (i.e. one part in 100) regarding liquids.
(k) (Mishnah): One part for 10 for liquids, one for 20 for
(l) Question: What does this mean?
1. Does it mean, a tenth of a liter for a sale of 10
liters for liquids, one part in 20 of a liter for a
sale of 20 liters for solids?
2. Or, does it mean, a tenth of a liter for a sale of
10 liters for liquids, or for a sale of 20 liters
3. This question is not resolved.
(a) (R. Levi): The punishment for false measures is more
severe than for incest - regarding false measures it says
"El", regarding incest it says "Eleh".
(b) Question: What is the source that "El" connotes strength?
(c) Answer: "V'Es Elei ha'Aretz Lakach".
(d) Question: Regarding incest it says "Eleh", which also
(e) Answer: No, "Eleh" comes to teach that Kares (applies to
Arayos, it) does not apply to false measures.
(f) Question: Since Kares applies to Arayos but not to false
measures, why are false measures considered more
(g) Answer: One can repent after sinning with Arayos, not
after sinning with false measures.
(h) (R. Levi): The punishment for stealing from a person is
worse than for stealing from Hekdesh.
1. Regarding stealing from a person, the Torah says
"Chet", before (he benefited, i.e.) "Me'ilah";
regarding stealing from Hekdesh, it does not say
"Chet" until after "Me'ilah".
(i) (R. Levi): Hash-m acts unlike people: Hash-m blessed
Yisrael with 22 letters (from Aleph to Tav - "Im
Bechukosai Telechu...Komemiyus") and cursed them with
eight (from Vov to Mem, "V'Im Bechukosai
1. Moshe blessed Yisrael with eight letters "V'Hayah Im
Shamo'a...l'Avdam" and cursed them with 22 -
"V'Hayah Im Lo Sishma...v'Ein Koneh".